angler I was glad to be able to help. If you have any questions after watching that video let me know!
Beautiful day to stay inside here in Chicagoland as we are getting DUMPED on with rain.
Did 25lbs of pork Hot Links and added high-temp Swiss cheese. Decided to try a 3mm plate grind vs my usual coarser preference. I am still only grinding once as I fear a 2nd grind on my L*M #8 would suck and I’ve been pretty happy with the single grind product.
I added cure so plan to break in my new PK100 smoker with them tomorrow.
I am making brats and snack sticks this coming weekend and wondering how much high temp cheese you generally add to a 25 lb batch?
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I have a question, this equip is brand new and first time used. We started getting a gray color every once in a while, the nut wasn’t to tight and the meat was consistently 31°
All parts washed and sanitized before as well as lightly oiled the plates and knives. We had a lot of fun, they are resting in the frig and I’ll start the pk100 in the morning to start drying.
The 2nd grind was way longer as I had to use the stomper quite a bit to get the meat to go down, didn’t think I was trying to go to fast but maybe I did. I’m def open to you veterans but I’ll say I love this new part of the business. This sausage is the mango tango from the bearded butcher mango and jalapeño with maple seasonings. Tomorrow we’re doing a cheddar brat. 😃
Someone asked this question, and I answered it in their thread. But by the time I was done adding links to USFDA docs etc, I figured it might be useful info and ramblings for others. So I moved it here, to be more easily found using SEARCH, or bookmarked.
Please Don’t let any of this scare you, or make you decide thems fighting words, and want to have an internet argument… NOT telling you how to handle your meat! 😉 Just some info for your perusal 😉
Leaving meat out after cooking…
I will do 2 hrs, and only handle with gloves, and don’t leave it out warm later. But this is a total guess in the dark, and I guarantee everyone will have their own take. That is just totally my guess and take on the food documents below, with no backing for my exact time. If I dry the heck out of sticks, so I’m sure Aw is < 0.85, I may leave them on counter in no-humidity Phoenix for days.
Short of testing your meat for bacterial growth in a lab, the only things I know of for guidance is all the stuff Food Safety Inspection Service publishes for commercial operations and food handlers. Maybe that is a high standard for someone in their kitchen, but on the other hand, every restaurant and food company in USA complies, so maybe it’s not too high. In any case, its some datapoints to let YOU make your own decision, and maybe help research more.
---- extra pathogen info may be interesting to you, to help YOU decide how you want to handle your cooked and raw meat.-----
It totally depends on pH and dryness. And the temp and humidity you’re leaving it. Salami at pH 5.1, and Aw 0.9 can be fine. USFDA says anything with Aw less than 0.85 is fine. But you don’t really know your pH and Aw, usually, so it is a total guess. I have a pH meter, but haven’t bought an Aw meter yet…$500. If I weigh my meat before and after cooking/drying, I could use salami guidelines of > 35% weight loss to guesstimate Aw… but I’m too lazy to do that for snacksticks and I have a big enough refrigerator to not be worried about leaving them in fridge until eaten.
Therefore, I personally feel for myself that it is best to go with normal USFDA exposure times. So, meat that gets between 50 and 130f, has 6 hours in range before it needs to have a lethality treatment. Bacteria grows in that range.
Here is the link for FSIS treatment of “Leftovers”, i.e. cooked food you don’t immediately eat, and store for later:
“Bacteria grow rapidly between the temperatures of 40° F and 140° F. After food is safely cooked, hot food must be kept hot at 140° F or warmer to prevent bacterial growth. Within 2 hours of cooking food or after it is removed from an appliance keeping it warm, leftovers must be refrigerated. Throw away all perishable foods that have been left in room temperature for more than 2 hours (1 hour if the temperature is over 90° F, such as at an outdoor picnic during summer).”
The most common after-cooking food poisoning comes from staphylococcus Aureas. This is almost always caused by folks handling cooked meat with their bare hands. S. Aureas is pretty much ever-present on skin and hands. If you touch any skin after washing with hot soap and water, you probably have S Aureas on hands again. Now if you handle cooked sticks without gloves, you innoculate it. Then it starts to grow. Dropping temperature below 50f inhibits its growth, but doesn’t destroy it. So next time it is warmed up, it starts to grow again.
They say ground meat in general has a log2 level of s. Aureas in meat. So long as it doesn’t exceed log5, so another log3 growth, the pathogen doesn’t make the toxin that sickens you. Their estimate is 6 hrs total time between 50 and 130f, which must then immediately achieve a time-temp lethality combo from the Guide I reference below.
USFDA has info on the common pathogens, temps they grow, concerns for food handlers and proper handling, and when they achieve levels of concern. Page 14 of
FSIS Cooking Guideline for
Meat and Poultry Products
(Revised Appendix A)
Which you can google and download. The other one especially useful for food handlers is:
USFDA FSIS Meat and Poultry Hazards and Control Guide.
We had to read this in my squadron and take a food handlers test before we could be certified to even work at a booth handing out hot dogs at events like Phoenix International Raceway. It was a pain, but a good fundraiser, so we all did it.
Here is another good web page where FSIS consolidates safe Food Handling for various products:
Bought the Patty maker and was able to modify the smallest shoot by grinding the lip down to fit my L*m electric stuffer. Now getting ready to butcher a side of beef do you guys typically premix your seasonings into the meat before making the Pattie’s and freezing them or just add the seasoning once you get ready to cook them? Thanks for all of the advice and help
Found some pork belly locally from where I usually purchase it. $5.99/lb I told them thanks but no thanks. They had is sliced in the counter for $6.39!
What are most people paying now for pork belly? I can by good already cured bacon for $4ish a pound at Sam’s club.
I know I can make better bacon than the stuff you buy, but dang I ain’t spending that much! Last I bought to cure was under $3/lb. I know it’s went up, but wow!
Ok. Rant over.
My “group” has been making cold cure venison summer sausage for a few years. We are having serious challenges with mold, air pockets, and non-uniform shrinkage (instead of nice round shape, think violin). We use the Walton’s H Summer Sausage Seasoning and Sure Cure. We have a huge smoke house with an outdoor firebox and piped in smoke. We have accumulated all the right equipment to make the work fun. We typically make 250 pounds.
Our process: Double grind equal amounts of pork and venison. Mix spices and cure into meat. Stuff in 2.20 inch X 16 inch fibrous casings. Hang in smoke house and immediately begin 2 days of smoking. Let hang for approximately 6 - 8 weeks.
We have added full spectrum lights and a fan with the hopes of reducing mold but it doesn’t seem to be working.
Any comments would be most welcome.
I want to add some Siracha (paste) and/or Extreme hot sauce to batch of Meat Sticks. Maybe even expand it to Brats or Summer sausage. Problem is I have no idea how much? Does adding it during the meat processing dilute it? Or does it amplify it, like when added to water?
Also, Is there any concerns of the vinegar (or any other general ingredients) in liquid hot sauces causing issues with the science of meat processing? Thanks in advance.
I used nitrite in my first two experiences in making summer sausage and each time, I suddenly experienced a series of migraine headaches. I haven’t had them in years and I’m thinking that nitrite may be the trigger causing them.
I’ve been told that celery juice powder can be used instead of nitrite. Is this correct?
I am talking about cleaning and sanitation. (Yawn). Before you fall asleep or move on, here is why I am kind of OCD about cleaning. I spent a few years working Summers in the family sausage business. Cleaning and sanitation is HUGE, and literally can mean the difference between staying open or being shut down at an inspected commercial processing plant.
For most home processors, keeping our equipment and work space clean is about improving flavor, quality, and shelf life of the products you make. It also is about food safety, and making products that don’t have dangerous food-borne pathogens that could make you or others sick. Just because you cooked a product up to 160 degrees, does not mean it can’t make someone sick. Last of all, clean and well maintained equipment just works better.
When you think about cleaning work surfaces, start to think about anything that could directly or indirectly make contact with the meat. That includes your hands, by the way.
Anyone who has made sausage has probably observed how dried emulsified meat is like glue and is a real pain to get off of equipment. If you are working alone, do yourself a favor and as soon as you are finished with a piece of equipment, or a processing tub, rinse off the big chunks with the hottest water you have. Hot water is one of the best things I have found that can melt the fat and loosen the protein from surfaces. If the water is too hot for your hands, wear disposable rubber gloves.
Once you have the chunks off, you can go back later when you are all finished and scrub the rest off with a soap, hot water, and minimal effort to finish the clean up. Once the heavy gunk has dried on, it is much more difficult to remove.
Another thing that simplifies clean up is to use a plastic scraper to remove all the excess meat off of equipment before wash down. This does a couple of things: It reduces the amount of cleaners required and keeps the meat out of your sink or wash basin. In general, meat and fat in your drains is going to lead to problems sooner or later
If you are working with helpers, it can greatly simplify cleaning if someone can start washing down a piece of equipment as soon as you are done using it for the day. This allows the clean up to start before any meat residue begins to dry and reduces the time and effort involved. Depending on your processing area, you probably can use the space created by cleaning up and putting away dirty equipment sooner rather than later.
My favorite cleaner is a strong alkaline cleaner called Greased Lightening and it cuts fat and even smoke house/grill residue better than most other normal house-hold cleaners.
After you get everything cleaned up and dried, figure out a storage system that keeps it clean till the next time you use it. Equipment stored out in the open on the shelf in the garage or basement is going to accumulate dirt and grunge. Store your clean equipment in a tote with a lid or cover it with plastic film till you are ready to use it again.
Kind of just scratching the surface here. There have been whole books written on the topic of cleaning and sanitation. Would be interested to hear some of your own cleaning tricks.
Photo of my small removable equipment parts after wash down. The big stationary items have to be washed down on the carts and tables they operate on.
Picked up a prime packer brisket from Costco and a couple of choice chuck roasts to grind for ground beef and to make burger patties. I trimmed off some of the fat from the brisket and then combined that fat with some brisket trim I had from a brisket I am brining for corned beef. All together I had a little over 4 lbs. of nice brisket fat. I partially froze the fat and ground it through a 10mm plate to help render it into tallow. With the fat all ground I ground the partially frozen meat through a 10mm plate and then through a 6mm plate for a second grind. While going through the second grind I ground 6lbs. into my tub for burgers. The remaining meat was ground directly into Walton’s 1lb. beef bags. With all the grinding completed I weighed the 6lbs. of ground meat into 1/4lb. balls and used my burger press to make hamburger patties. With that all completed everything was put into the freezer and all equipment cleaned and put away. The next day I took the ground fat and placed it into an enameled Dutch oven and placed it into my Big Green Egg at 275 deg. Indirect heat to render out. I stirred the fat every 45 min. so nothing would burn. After 5 hrs. I poured the rendered fat into a bowl through a fine mesh strainer and again through a coffee filter into a sterilized quart mason jar. When the mason jar cooled off it was placed into the refrigerator overnight to chill. The next day I got a nice jar of clean white tallow to cook with. Thanks for looking.BD931024-E8EE-4CAD-B149-E6E2AF142A9E.jpeg A2AD78E4-548B-458A-A34B-04E1C2D0CACA.jpeg 874709A8-033D-4BD9-B34A-604191B01067.jpeg 46CFB3F4-E231-4034-A5B2-075361823B63.jpeg 26B27978-6D00-497B-8D41-BC0D23DD2873.jpeg 3D96365D-0F43-4C7D-9A00-639EDE67C7E0.jpeg 84A1EDA2-B8B5-436C-A59C-CA4B339D7479.jpeg 2665C820-9C5A-4C7F-A65E-1F283840AA1F.jpeg AAE94B7A-30E1-4FE3-91AD-35763ADAC67F.jpeg 054292AB-C721-4BDB-B8D6-6EF6DC25BFAB.jpeg !
With inspiration and guidance from Deepwoodsbutcher and others here, my friend and I bought a live hog from a local producer and slaughtered it today.
The hog was larger than I would have preferred at #295 lbs live weight, mainly from a logistics and handling standpoint, but the actual slaughter went pretty well.
I threw together a small confinement stall on my utility trailer for transporting the pig to our hunting cabin. We have a good assortment of processing facilities there for butchering deer which helped a lot.
Probably the biggest issue we had was skinning the hog which we chose to do while it was hanging. Overall it went pretty well. It took longer than we anticipated. We did use the winch on an ATV to help with the skinning and we were glad to have it.
After skinning, gutting and splitting, we transported the halves back home to my outbuilding to chill overnight and plan to break them down tomorrow morning.
The hog was pretty chill about the whole thing which made putting him down quickly and humanely much easier.
Hey all, I’m new to conversational sites like this but figured id give this a try since making meat sticks seems to be my new obsession and I have no one else to talk about it with lol.
I did 12.5 lbs. of 50/50 pork butt and lean pork loin with the buffalo snack stick seasoning while watching the snow fall this weekend. I found a thread on this site previously that mentioned it’s a little light on the buffalo flavor so I added an additional 1.5 oz. of the seasoning for more flavor. I also added 1.5 lbs. of hi temp blue cheese. The seasoning was a bit disappointing. Not the buffalo zing I would expect from buffalo wings. It seemed to lack the vinegar flavor I am accustomed to. I read a previous thread that mentioned vinegar would do something to the proteins and make an undesirable finished product.
I was wondering has anyone actually added buffalo sauce to this recipe to see what happens? I know Franks makes powder seasoning which has a vinegar in it. Or i could substitute the water in the meat with Franks Buffalo sauce.
If not using vinegar or hot sauce is there any substitute I can use to achieve my goal?
Please give feedback on this product. Like do they work, how well do they work and are they worth the money. Whatever you can share about this product. Never seen or heard of before. Very interesting.
Thank you in advance for your response’s
Visit waltons.com to find everything for meat processing.
Walton's - Everything But The Meat!