• I just got some high temp blue cheese was gonna order some buffalo blue cheese snack stick seasoning was wondering if I could put some franks red hot in with it? Any ideas was gonna make it with pork butt but I’m not sure if the vinegar in the hat sauce would cause a problem? I made a batch of buffalo blue cheese before and wasn’t too impressed with the buffalo flavor, I would like to make it like bitting into a hot wing ( I like my hot wings hot and with blue cheese

  • Team Orange

    The vinegar in the Franks will cause you a lot of issues getting good protein extraction
    works ok for jerky but problems in snack sticks. At least that’s been my experience Others should chime in here if they have a way

  • Team Blue Admin Walton's Employee Power User

    Bhouin1086 what DeerSlayer says is correct, the vinegar is going to start to denature your proteins. You might be able to use a binder like the super bind to mitigate that, sounds like an interesting thing to test our!

  • Of course, when Johnathan says “experiment” he means to try a small (think less than 3 lb) batch first. If that works okay, then go for the full size. That way, if it doesn’t work out, no great loss.

  • Regular Contributors

    Jonathon I agree, be careful changing the pH in sticks. In my experience, Vinegar is great for tenderizing whole muscle meats. Using it in a snack stick has made mine mushy and loses the “snap” I like. If you like the sour flavor, I like the encapsulated citric acid. I have tried a fermenting system like one might use in a summer sausage on hold the stuffed sticks overnight before smoking with nice results. I like to take small step in experiments…it can easily go from “Meat to Dog treats”. I hope this helps.

  • Team Blue Admin Walton's Employee Power User

    Yeah, sorry I meant that I would experiment with this at work next week! Not for anyone else to do it, I’ve got some pork butt that I need to do something with!

  • There’s a powdered form of Franks Hot Sauce and Buffalo Ranch flavors (maybe others?) available at Costco and Restaurant Depot, Amazon too. Might be what you’re looking for! Good luck

  • Jonathon please let me know what the outcome is

  • Team Blue Admin Walton's Employee Power User

    sakepower ive tried the powder ranch and was disappointed, didn’t know about the powdered franks, will try that. I’m a huge fan of franks particularly on eggs

  • Jonathon me too I just want that hot flavor in my snack sticks!!!

  • Team Blue Admin Walton's Employee Power User

    Okay, so I went to Sams and found some of the powdered franks red hot. Vinegar powder is a prominent ingredient and vinegar will drop the pH of the meat and start to denature the proteins and make protein extraction very difficult. I did 2 7 lb batches, both with the Ranch Flavored Snack Stick. On one batch I mixed 2 heaping tablespoons of the mix at the same time that I mixed in the seasoning, cure, sure gel and water, and hand mixed it for about 8 minutes. There was very little stickiness to the meat, it sort of got mushy but it did not stick together well. On the second one, I got good protein extraction and then added in the franks red hot powder. Once I added the powder it started to break down the proteins quickly. There was almost no difference in the meat when I loaded them into the stuffer.

    I smoked them in our commercial smokehouse that can set the humidity, set up a good smoke schedule and cooked them. As soon as I opened the smoker I knew what had happened, the casings were very wrinkled for a batch coming out of that smoker. Sure enough biting into them produced a pretty bland taste, especially when you consider I added 2 big table spoons of the Red Hot Powder, and that stuff is strong!

    So, basically, we fatted out. For those who don’t know this is what happens when the protein, fats, water, seasoning and additives don’t bind together and then the fat renders out of the snack stick. The odd thing is that I don’t see any fat between the meat and the casing. I couldn’t prove that the fat all ran out and dripped down because I ran a shower cycle at the end that would have washed it all down the drain but I am fairly confident that this is what happened.

    This is exactly why Encapsulated Citric Acid is encapsulated. The cotton seed oil is designed to not melt until it reaches 130° and by that the point the meat has pretty much been set.

    So, in my opinion adding powdered (and certainly liquid) Hot Sauce that has vinegar or vinegar powder into it is not a good idea.

  • Regular Contributors

    Absolutely what I have seen in a couple of tests. In my past work I have had different encapsulated ingredients made for a different food purpose. They are designed to accomplish a specific task. My advice is to take it step by step, or follow recommendations from some one on the site who has already done the testing. Great information! Thanks

    On another subject,

  • Regular Contributors

    Jonathon . By the way, are you getting more Hi-melt blue cheese in?

  • Regular Contributors

    Jonathon I believe the acid introduced, changes the SFI, solid fat index, of the meat block. I’m not able to reference the science. However in my tests it seems to hold true. Dave

  • Jonathon thanks for testing that out for me that’s great info!!! Disappointed that it didn’t turn out

  • Team Blue Admin Walton's Employee Power User

    Dave R For the time being we will not be getting anymore High-Temp Bleu Cheese, sorry!

    As for doing the tests I was happy to do it, it allowed us to get what happens when acid is introduced to meat on video! It was interesting to see and we will be using it in future videos!

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