Pork to venison ratio- summer sausage

[Denny O]

Yep, I just looked mine up.
I have 2 different summer sausages that I do and one is at least 20% and my other one follows,
For 6 - 3 pound logs, 12 pounds deer, 3 pounds fatty pork shoulder (I’ve never added extra back fat) and a short 3 pounds of my smoked pepper cheese, then the seasonings and cure. It is very creamy and not dry at all. Still seems to have enough grease in it to carry a great flavor. I smoke them to a finished temp of 154/156 degrees.

[Denny O]

Jonathon Ok, question for all the ratio gurus out there in Meatgisitics land,

From the recent thread that salmonmaster just did

https://meatgistics.waltons.com/topic/6208/cotto-salami-h-summer-sausage-the-results-are-in

He spelled out very clear his meat block ratio for instance, “50/50 pork butt, deer burger 80/20 w/ beef fat”.
Is he assuming that the pork shoulder is 50/50 meat to fat? Never mind that is a no.
He is mixing 50% butt with 50% deer that has 20% beef fat in it, correct?
With that in mind then what is the fat %? Give me the math equation please.

[processhead]

Denny O said in Pork to venison ratio- summer sausage:

Jonathon Ok, question for all the ratio gurus out there in Meatgisitics land,

From the recent thread that salmonmaster just did

https://meatgistics.waltons.com/topic/6208/cotto-salami-h-summer-sausage-the-results-are-in

He spelled out very clear his meat block ratio for instance, “50/50 pork butt, deer burger 80/20 w/ beef fat”.
Is he assuming that the pork shoulder is 50/50 meat to fat? Never mind that is a no.
He is mixing 50% butt with 50% deer that has 20% beef fat in it, correct?
With that in mind then what is the fat %? Give me the math equation please.

For me, a simple way to figure out the ratios on a problem like this is to substitute an actual weight for each ingredient.
For example we know that it is a 50/50 mix of pork butt and deer burger. So pretend your are using 1 lb of pork butt and 1 lb of deer burger. The Total Weight is 2 lbs.

Assuming the 1 lb of pork butt is 80 / 20 lean then that is .8 lb lean pork and .2 lb fat pork.

The 1 lb of deer burger is 50/50 Fat/Lean. So that is .5 lb of lean and .5 lb of beef fat. Now add up the lean from each source to get a total lean and the fat from each source to get a total fat.

Total Lean = Pork lean + Deer lean = .8 +.5= 1.3 Total Lean
Total Fat = Pork Fat + Beef Fat = .2 + .5 = .7 Total Fat

Percent Lean = Total Lean / Total Weight x 100 = 1.3/2 x 100= 65%
Percent Fat = Total Fat / Total Weight x 100 = .7 / 2 x 100 = 35%

You know you got the math right when the sum of Percent Lean and Percent Fat = 100%

[Jonathon]

Denny O processhead math above checks out, the two “arguments” would be the on why we are assuming the deer burger is 50/50 deer and beef fat. I think it is 80/20 and then what the pork butt starting fat content is. So, if we go with an 80/20 deer burger mix that changes the math, but the equation is correct.

Also, it depends on if the fat cap was scrapped off or not, and how big it was, to begin with. I see pork butts occasionally that are very fatty and sometimes ones that have a minimal fat cap.

From what I see he is mixing 50/50 with straight pork butt and then deer that has had 20% beef fat added. So it is 70/30 (pork butt and being generous with fay%) and 80/20 for the deer burger. So, the fat content of 50% of the mix is 30$ and the other 50% is 20%, making it 25%.

It’s early though, so my brain may be misreading something, however, it was even earlier when processhead responded. Either way, the equation he provides above it correct.

[zerr]

We do 50/ 50, can be fried, used in spaghetti, chili, BUT the best is, make a 1.5" roll and wrap in foil. Bake for 30 Minutes at 350 and slice thin for a hot snack watching football.

[zerr]

OH sorry this is Sausage. For summer sausage i just follow the spice box.

[Denny O]

Jonathon What I seem to be seeing on various threads lead me to believe is most of you are doing a 50/50 fat to lean meat ratio when using equal parts of pork butt and deer, 50% fat. I believe the fat ratio would be 33.3%.

[salmonmaster]

Jonathon I live on the west coast, just got up, first cup of coffee, you guy’s are way ahead of me in the thinking dept. I was thinking when I wrote the meat block I should have wrote it a little defferent, might be a little confusing. I’ll try to do better next time. You got it right. Say on a 8 pound meat block, half of the meat, or 4 lbs. is whole pork butt, the other half of the meat block or 4lbs. is venison burger . The burger is 80% deer or elk, and 20% beef fat. So I was figuring that an average fat content for the meat block, as a whole, would be 25% or so. I have seen those 2" thick fat caps on some of those pork butts, haven’t had one for awhile, but I would probably just wack some of the fat off till it looked right. So yes, 50/50 pork butt, deer burger 80/20 w/beef fat COFFEE!

[Denny O]

Denny O
salmonmaster Please, I’m not picking your thread out! You’re just a very recent example of what I’ve been seeing.
Seems to me sitting here reading I seem to get the impression that most of you prefer a fatty summer sausage that leans to a 50% fat content. I also think that 33-1/3rd% is very high too.

[salmonmaster]

Denny O I really didn’t think you were picking me out, I know what you mean. I’ve seen a few that where a little confusing too. I’m no mathematician, believe me, but this is the way I figure it out

To me, lean meat is lean meat. But say you have 3 different meats, and the fat contents were all different, say 20%, 35%, and 25%. You would take the three numbers, add them together, and divide by 3 to get your fat average which would be 26.6%. Don’t know if I’m doing it right, but I would really like to know.

[Denny O]

salmonmaster Reduce your fraction, divide by 3 because it will go into each evenly = 1/3.
Where does the #2 come from?

[salmonmaster]

Denny O to me, in my limited amount of math education the fat percent is already figured out. So you have 80/20 venison, 70/30 pork. You have two different numbers, to get the average, you would divide, by two. That’s where my 2 comes from. Now if I had 50lbs. Of lean meat, and needed to figure out how much fat to put in to it, to make it a 80/20 mix, that would be a different equation. But I already know what % of fat I’m dealing with. I’m dealing with 20% and 30%. So to get my average fat %, I would add those 2 numbers together, and divide by 2. Now If I wanted to know how much fat to put in 50lbs. Of lean meat to make it a 80/20 mix, I would just ask google because it’s just a lot easier for me

[Denny O]

salmonmaster You don’t need to remember, Jon has you covered.

[Jonathon]

Denny O 1st, appologies to all my math teachers who I have made comments on in the last 10 years cause they always said you wont have a calculator everywhere you go!
Well, turns out there is more to math than just a calculator!

When most people say they are doing a 50/50 they are talking about 50% deer and 50% pork butt. If they were doing what you were thinking (and maybe some are) a 50/50 with 50% being deer and 50% being pork that is half lean and half fat (too many 50s so I decided to go half and half) then you would be at 25% which would be perfect. Break it into 1/4s, both 1/4 of the deer is lean, 1/4 of the pork is lean and 1/4 is fat, 25%. By my math at least and man I HOPE I am not wrong on that!

If someone did 50/50 with just deer and pork butt (which I think is how it is most commonly done) then we have 30% of 1/2 the meat as fat. Spread that 30% over the rest of the meat and we have 15% total. If I am wrong on that I will eat the one chip challenge myself!

[paulsje]

salmonmaster I used 4 Cups of water to mix my cure and spices, I did let it dry overnight after stuffing, maybe I should have shortened that time as well

[paulsje]

I also cooked the sausage in my oven at 185 for 6 hrs + 2hrs at 195 to bring the internal temp to 152, then into the ice bath. still learning

[salmonmaster]

paulsje what I’ve been using is half pork butt so 50%, and half venison so 50%. But my venison is already ground with 20% beef fat. So your 16 pounds of venison, and 9 pounds of pork butt would be very lean, especially if it’s just straight venison, with no fat added. You would want at least a 50/50 mixture of pork butt and straight venison, and preferably more. At least 20% fat is what your really shooting for, in my opinion. Another thing is, what I was told was venison is a dry meat, the more venison, the more water. I was using the same amount of water as you are, 32oz. Per 25 lbs. Now I put in 45oz. Per 25 pounds and it’s a lot better. One more thing is, if you want juicy meat, use a binder. It makes your sausage a lot more moist. The sure gel meat binder that waltons sells works great. You’d really be surprised in the difference between binder and no binder. A lot more juicier with the binder. And remember if you are not useing a cure accelerater, like citric acid, you have to let it sit overnight in refer. Before cooking for the cure to do it’s job. Hope this gives you a little help. Just keep reading and asking questions from everybody, it’ll get better.

[paulsje]

salmonmaster Thank you for the tips, and I wish I’d found this blog before I made the sausage. I did use a binder (1 C) in my mix, so it’s good to know that I can put a little more water. I was trying to accomplish a more lean version of sausage, but I see the error in my ways. I use straight Venison so from these posts I do see that more fat would have worked better. I did not use citric acid because I was not sure what is is for, good to know, I did give the sausage 24 hrs to cure before stuffing. It’s edible just not great! Thanks again. The next batch will be much better with all of these great suggestions.

[salmonmaster]

paulsje just keep on reading, and asking. It gets better. Sometimes small changes can make a big difference. To see what the citric, or smooth acid, which I prefer, does for taste, go to store and buy some of that sliced pepperoni. When you taste it, you’ll notice the tang, or the little bit of citric pucker that you get from it. To me, it’s kinda what makes cured sausage of any kind, taste like sausage .

[Denny O]

Jonathon I agree with the 25% fat content in your middle paragraph, But I disagree with your last analogy of 15%.