MNmeat: Sorry to be late sticking my oar in your pond. I’ve made a lot of different brats both as fresh sausage and as smoked. I get best results stuffing fresh pork casings. You do not need to mix the meat as long as when making summer sausage or snack sticks. Also, if you grind the lean meat and the fat through different grinder plates, using a slightly larger plate for the fat, then mix the fat and lean together it seems to give a better, pleasing appearance to the product. The fat contrasts with the darker color of the meat and gives your sausage a nice marbled look. Good luck.
G

The Hawaiian seasoning is milder than some of the hotter seasonings; it has a nice tropical flavor profile with a touch of pineapple. I think, as a seasoning for jerky, the drying process would intensify the flavor and give a nice finished product–something my wife and grandkids would like; not too salty or too spicy.
Tbone, I also think adding a little soy sauce and maybe some pineapple juice would be great. Let’s see some pictures and a taste report when you get it done.
Best,
G

AndyMan: It may help you to take a look at my post from August “Summer Sausage Nightmare” and the replies from Jonathan and others. Looking back, my problem was a lack of mixing the meat properly. I was not getting enough protein extraction, so the fat in the meat was cooking out during smoking. This left the Summer Sausage tasting dry and with the mouth feel of a sawdust log. I purchased one of the meat mixers from Walton’s and it fixed this problem. My small 20 pound mixer was not expensive and does a great job mixing the meat. It’s well made and easy to clean.

Also, by following the smoking times suggested by Waltons and keeping a pan of water in the smoker my sausage was “stalling out” in the last critical hour of the smoke process–never reaching an internal temp of 160F. Of course, your product must be brought up to 160F internal temp if you expect to be safe from food bacteria. We don’t want to make people sick with our sausage. For me, the solution, as suggested by several of the “Old Pros” who follow this site, was to stop smoking after about four hours and transfer the product to a heated water bath to bring the internal temp up to 160F. I was getting to 145F - 150F in the smoker, but couldn’t close the gap to 160F. About 15 min. in a hot water bath (slightly below boiling) did the trick. The sausage comes out of the water fully cooked, casings full and tight, without wrinkles, and the fat is fully emulsified.

Best of luck with your sausage.

G.

I’ve decided, thanks to all the posts following my original post on 12 Jan 19, to amend my proposed “Resolution” for Austin Walton’s New Year’s attention:
First, I continue to see a need for improvement in the instructions for use of seasonings, additives and cures. I’m convinced that the instructions should include BOTH typical American receipe volume measures (cups, tablespoons, teaspoons, etc.) AND measurement by weight. Many users, me included, have digital scales and use weight to determine the amount of additives, seasonings and cure per amount of meat. However, I also follow and sometimes adapt recipes from some of the classic sources, like Rytek Kutas’ “Great Sausage Recipes and Meat Curing” and “Home Sausage Making” by Perry & Reavis. These and other authorities all list their ingredients using traditional volume measures, not weight. Kutas, for example, shows the 8 ingredients for Fresh Pork Sausage (Breakfast) listed as ingredient amounts for 25 pounds of meat and for 10 pounds of meat, all the ingredients listed in traditional volume measures. There is still room for improvement in the Walton’s Conversion Chart.
Second, since I usually make sausage based on the weight of the meat in hand, and not based on a “standard” 25 pound meat block, every recipe requires some conversion math. For example, I just made 23.6 pounds of pork breakfast sausage, stuffed into Walton’s pre-tubed sheep casing (24-26 mm) and using my own secret recipe. I had to convert the seasoning measures from my recipe for 10 pounds of meat up, for the amount of meat I was processing. (23.6/10 = 2.36 X the 10 lb. recipe measured amount) Sometimes this requires a little rounding, but this is salt, pepper, sage, and other spices, not nuclear physics.
I want to say again how great I think Austin and Jonathan are at getting information out to those of us who labor in the art and science of sausage. Walton’s products and the information at Meatgistics are great. Using the Internet and You Tube to inform us are great advances. Walton’s should be proud of its commitment to its customers. My only suggestion is that if the instructions for use of seasonings, cures and additives may be simplified and made more clear, it would benefit us all.
Finally, if you haven’t tried Walton’s pre-tubed natural casing, by all means do give it a try. The ease of loading Walton’s pre-tubed casing on the stuffer tube is well worth the price, both in time saved and in reduced frustration. I hope never again to try to sort through a skein of dried salted sheep casing trying to fit that tiny opening onto my stuffer’s smallest tube. Walton’s pre-tubed casing is the answer!
Thanks to all who have followed the original post. I appreciate all the comments and advice. I hope this helps.
Good luck,
G

Austin and Jonathan:

I recently spent some time in Maui, and on the breakfast buffet at the Hyatt Regency was introduced to a fantastic sausage. This Hawaiian style Portugese sausage was served sliced and grilled. The taste was unique–a sweet flavor of tropical fruit with a typical European pork sausage base–paprika and a touch of heat. I’ve tried to reproduce the sausage I enjoyed in Hawaii but without much success.

So, instead of screwing around trying to smoke octopus, and some of your other recent strange ideas, why not have Waltons send Austin, Jonathan, and their significant others out to Maui for a week or so, to find and eat this unique Hawaiian sausage. Then, come back and produce an Excaliber seasoning packet to reproduce Hawaiian Portugese Sausage. We need this a lot more than smoked octopus.
All the best,

Greg Dahl

DANTE: Please see my thread (Summer Sausage Nightmare) from August in the Meat Processing section. Sounds like we had similar issues.
One of the gurus on this forum suggested that I stop smoking after no more than 4 hours, as the longer time to get to an internal temp of 160 F is a “stall” (heat loss of the smoker and product (including water pan) is equal to heat in to the smoker) so the product sits at about 130 F and internal temp goes nowhere.) The solution is, after 3-4 hours in the smoker, transfer to a water bath at poaching temp (about 200 F). This brings internal temp of the Summer Sausage up to 160 F in about 20 min, not 5 or 6 hours, and helps prevent “fatting out” of the product. Product retains moisture, casings are nice and full, and remain smooth.
Also suggested for my SS Nightmare: More complete mixing of the meat before stuffing into casings. I found that 8-9 min of mixing in a hand operated Waltons small meat mixer works well, giving a good sticky feel and appearance to the meat and provides for good protein extraction and fat/water binding in the meat (it becomes an emulsion) without total loss of texturing. I also found that grinding the lean meat (beef or venison) separate from the pork fat and adding the fat to the cold ground meat preserves some of the traditional texture of SS.
Don’t give up on the Walton’s Excaliber seasonings–they offer some great stuff–but the techniques of getting to a good “family ready” final product may take some adjustments. One final comment, I found that adding Encapsulated Citric Acid (ECA) as is frequently recommended here at Walton’s for SS and snack sticks did not work for me. It gave a strongly acidic taste that made my SS inedable.
Good luck. It’s truly frustrating to go to all the effort and expense of making a batch of Summer Sausage, only to end up tossing the whole batch. I’ve been there, too.
G

Jonathan:
Sorry, the seasoning mix on this batch was my own recipe, not one of yours. I’ve received a shipment of your Summer Sausage H seasoning & cure for the next batch, will probably add some mustard seed, too.
In this batch I did use a pink salt cure #1 in appropriate amount and added 2.4 oz of carrot fiber to 15 lb of meat. I did not use Encapsulated Citric Acid.

The meat was refrigerator chilled prior to mixing, to about 36 degrees. I added about 16 - 18 oz. of ice water.
Since I did not use Encapsulated Citric Acid, I put the stuffed casings in the refrigerator over night to let them cure. The next morning I let the stuffed casings come up to near room temp, probably about 60 degrees, before hanging them in the smoker. I followed Walton’s recommended time and temp schedule, applying smoke only in the 2nd through 4th hours.

The more I think about this the more I am convinced my problem is in the mixing process. My first failed batch was hand mixed, but not mixed long enough to develop good protein extraction so the sausage fatted-out and was dry with loose, wrinkled casings. My second batch was mixed in a new powered bucket type mixer and perhaps I over-mixed. The product, after smoking and heating to 156 degrees, was the consistency of an emulsified product, like a hot dog. None of the meat/fat particles were retained. In normal Summer Sausage you can distinguish the texture of the ground meat. Mine was emulsified, very uniform but with the fatting-out also very dry. Not a good mouth feel at all. Maybe I need to try a hand powered mechanical meat mixer, mixing at a slower speed to retain the texture of the product. A mechanical mixer operated by hand at 35 - 40 RPM would make 280 - 320 revolutions in the recommended 8 minutes of mixing. The mixing blade in my bucket mixer, powered by a 1/2 inch drill motor, is turning at 800 to 1000 RPM. Maybe it’s just too fast for summer sausage. Should make great hot dogs though, if I can just retain the fat in the product.

What do you experts at Walton’s think?

Jonathon The Hawaiian seasoning does have a mild, slightly sweet, good porky flavor. I think I’m going to use it in the next batch of breakfast sausage I make; something a little different than the normal “country sausage” flavor profile. It should be good as a breakfast link in natural sheep casings.

I also think it would be good as a brat with pineapple added and just a splash of Chinese Soy Sauce. Sliced about 3/4 inch on a diagonal cut as the meat in a Chinese stir fry with onion, celery, bok choy and noodles. It would be a spectacular asian dinner centerpiece. Serve with ice cold Chinese beer.
You guys should hire me for recipe development!
Greg.

Jonathon
Jonathan: I’ve experienced stalls when smoking briskit and clearly my summer sausage stalled out. I never understood a stall until I read your post, then the light bulb came on. Thanks. That is the best, clearest, explanation I’ve see in all my reading and research–a “stall” as a balance between heat energy in and energy loss through evaporation.
I did have a water pan in the smoker, but as my product started loosing fat (due to improper protein extraction) the fat collected in the water pan. The liquid fat floating on the surface of the water sort of sealed the water in the pan, preventing the water from evaporating and kept the humidity in my smoker low. Result: dry sausage.
Jonathan, thanks for all your help and your answers. I’m keeping on, as soon as my new mixer arrives from WALTON’S I’ll be making another batch. You guys have earned my business for life.
Greg

denny66: Last summer I made two batches of summer sausage that were so terrible I couldn’t even get my daughter’s dog to eat it. The sausage “de-fatted” during smoking and was so dry it was inedable. See my post “Summer Sausage Nightmare” and the following posts by Austin and Jonathan. I was not mixing the meat enough to get proper protein extraction.
I bought one of the small meat mixers from Walton’s and it made a world of difference. I could mix the meat and seasoning properly. In 7 to 8 minutes the protein extraction became obvious–the meat changes from “ground beef” to a more cohesive, sticky mass. However, too much mixing and you lose the particle definition of meat and fat in your sausage–finished it looks like bologna or a hot dog. Some sausage makers grind their lean meat and fat separately, adding fat to the mixer toward the end of the mixing process to preserve some of that definition that we like to see.

I hope you have good luck with your sausage. The right amount of mixing is critical to getting a good product.

G.

I’ve decided, thanks to all the posts following my original post on 12 Jan 19, to amend my proposed “Resolution” for Austin Walton’s New Year’s attention:
First, I continue to see a need for improvement in the instructions for use of seasonings, additives and cures. I’m convinced that the instructions should include BOTH typical American receipe volume measures (cups, tablespoons, teaspoons, etc.) AND measurement by weight. Many users, me included, have digital scales and use weight to determine the amount of additives, seasonings and cure per amount of meat. However, I also follow and sometimes adapt recipes from some of the classic sources, like Rytek Kutas’ “Great Sausage Recipes and Meat Curing” and “Home Sausage Making” by Perry & Reavis. These and other authorities all list their ingredients using traditional volume measures, not weight. Kutas, for example, shows the 8 ingredients for Fresh Pork Sausage (Breakfast) listed as ingredient amounts for 25 pounds of meat and for 10 pounds of meat, all the ingredients listed in traditional volume measures. There is still room for improvement in the Walton’s Conversion Chart.
Second, since I usually make sausage based on the weight of the meat in hand, and not based on a “standard” 25 pound meat block, every recipe requires some conversion math. For example, I just made 23.6 pounds of pork breakfast sausage, stuffed into Walton’s pre-tubed sheep casing (24-26 mm) and using my own secret recipe. I had to convert the seasoning measures from my recipe for 10 pounds of meat up, for the amount of meat I was processing. (23.6/10 = 2.36 X the 10 lb. recipe measured amount) Sometimes this requires a little rounding, but this is salt, pepper, sage, and other spices, not nuclear physics.
I want to say again how great I think Austin and Jonathan are at getting information out to those of us who labor in the art and science of sausage. Walton’s products and the information at Meatgistics are great. Using the Internet and You Tube to inform us are great advances. Walton’s should be proud of its commitment to its customers. My only suggestion is that if the instructions for use of seasonings, cures and additives may be simplified and made more clear, it would benefit us all.
Finally, if you haven’t tried Walton’s pre-tubed natural casing, by all means do give it a try. The ease of loading Walton’s pre-tubed casing on the stuffer tube is well worth the price, both in time saved and in reduced frustration. I hope never again to try to sort through a skein of dried salted sheep casing trying to fit that tiny opening onto my stuffer’s smallest tube. Walton’s pre-tubed casing is the answer!
Thanks to all who have followed the original post. I appreciate all the comments and advice. I hope this helps.
Good luck,
G

Jonathon;Parksider:@mikeihuntr – Thanks, Jonathon, but the credit goes to John C Parksider. His advice got me going toward the water bath technique, now I’ve got to go to CraigsList looking for a Louisiana Turkey Fryer!
G

Parksider has the right idea! Smoke the sausage using Jonathan’s recommended schedule until you have applied about four hours of smoke (after an hour of drying before the smoke goes on) then remove the sausage from the smoker and go directly into a hot water bath–poaching temp not rolling boil. Take to an internal temp of 160 F then a cold shower or ice water bath. When internal temp drops below about 120 F remove the sausage from the water, let it dry at room temp for at least two hours to “bloom.” Then refrigerate, vacuum seal, and freeze.
No need to put the product into plastic before the water bath; the smoke has been absorbed and the water bath does not remove or dilute the flavor. I’ve found that Parksider’s advice made a world of difference in my sausage making process. Both Summer Sausage and smoked Hawaiian flavored brats came out with great flavor profiles, smooth attractive casings, juicy and smoked to perfection.
The only downside is you may need to buy a big stockpot. I hijacked one from my wife’s kitchen.
Good luck.
G

DANTE: Please see my thread (Summer Sausage Nightmare) from August in the Meat Processing section. Sounds like we had similar issues.
One of the gurus on this forum suggested that I stop smoking after no more than 4 hours, as the longer time to get to an internal temp of 160 F is a “stall” (heat loss of the smoker and product (including water pan) is equal to heat in to the smoker) so the product sits at about 130 F and internal temp goes nowhere.) The solution is, after 3-4 hours in the smoker, transfer to a water bath at poaching temp (about 200 F). This brings internal temp of the Summer Sausage up to 160 F in about 20 min, not 5 or 6 hours, and helps prevent “fatting out” of the product. Product retains moisture, casings are nice and full, and remain smooth.
Also suggested for my SS Nightmare: More complete mixing of the meat before stuffing into casings. I found that 8-9 min of mixing in a hand operated Waltons small meat mixer works well, giving a good sticky feel and appearance to the meat and provides for good protein extraction and fat/water binding in the meat (it becomes an emulsion) without total loss of texturing. I also found that grinding the lean meat (beef or venison) separate from the pork fat and adding the fat to the cold ground meat preserves some of the traditional texture of SS.
Don’t give up on the Walton’s Excaliber seasonings–they offer some great stuff–but the techniques of getting to a good “family ready” final product may take some adjustments. One final comment, I found that adding Encapsulated Citric Acid (ECA) as is frequently recommended here at Walton’s for SS and snack sticks did not work for me. It gave a strongly acidic taste that made my SS inedable.
Good luck. It’s truly frustrating to go to all the effort and expense of making a batch of Summer Sausage, only to end up tossing the whole batch. I’ve been there, too.
G

mikelies Thanks for your comment. Good point on testing. See my second post.
G

For those who have replied to my original post, let me make one thing clear: I think Walton’s does a great job of educating its customers and responding to our questions and problems here at Meatgistics. I credit Austin and Jonathan for all their hard work making the information accessable. My point is that as good as Walton’s is, there are a few little areas for improvement. One area that has been frustrating for me as a consumer has been the inconsistent instructions in recipes and on the labels of seasonings, additives, and cures. Also, for me, the “Conversion Chart” is more difficult to use than it should be.

I have been making sausage for a while, now, and I’ve made some mistakes. I try not to make the same mistake twice. I do have a digital scale and a copy of the Rytek Kutas “Bible.” I measure my seasonings and additives by weight. But not everyone has a scale. For many users, especially those new to the art and science of sausage making, common kitchen measurments are more useful. All I ask is that Walton’s take a look at improving the descriptions of seasonings, additives, and cures and that the Conversion Chart get a re-do to make it user friendly. My only intent is to make this easier for us all, and help Walton’s continue to improve.
Best regards,
G

Austin, Happy New Year! You’ve done a good job with Walton’s on-line presence and Meatgistics site. I thought I’d send you a Resolution for the New Year: If you read through all the threads that complain about inconsistent results I believe you will conclude, as I have, that Walton’s is failing when it comes to clear, accurate, instructions for the use of its seasonings, additives and cures.

Each product should be labeled telling the user the amount to use in cups, tablespoons and teaspoons; not X.XXX ounces or XXX grams per XXX pounds of meat. Give us the amounts for 5 lbs, 10 lbs, and 25 pounds of meat. And give us the amounts in a standardized, easy, format for every seasoning, additive, or cure you sell.

I know you have a “Conversion Chart” that purports to scale down the amounts of seasoning, additive or cure from a 25 lb. meat block to smaller amounts to use for less meat, but your chart is f’d up. Each time I have tried to download or copy it, it has failed to come through as a readable document. Don’t you guys have Excel spreadsheets or Word tables? Have you heard of PDF?

It would also help us folks out here in smokerland, if you gave better descriptions of each seasoning, additive, or cure. How, exactly, is this stuff used? When starting in this activity of processing meat into sausage or cured products it’s d**n confusing trying to figure out which binder, enhancer, cure or seasoning to use. Doing it wrong and be expensive and unsafe. Most of us don’t have the luxury of making batch after batch of something, changing one element at a time trying to get the recipe right. I’m afraid, as loyal as I am to Waltons, if you can’t get this fixed I’ll be looking elsewhere for my seasonings, additives and cures.
I hope you guys put some effort into fixing this as a priority in the new year.
Best,

G

hinoon: don’t feel like you are alone. Working with Walton’s Excaliber seasonings and their packaged cures and additives can be a real math challenge. Also, the “Conversion Chart” that they have on the Walton’s site, in my experience, is a mess. It should be set up as an Excel sheet or a Word table, then downloadable as a PDF. Instead, each time I’ve tried to download or print it, it comes out f’d up.

G

The Hawaiian seasoning is milder than some of the hotter seasonings; it has a nice tropical flavor profile with a touch of pineapple. I think, as a seasoning for jerky, the drying process would intensify the flavor and give a nice finished product–something my wife and grandkids would like; not too salty or too spicy.
Tbone, I also think adding a little soy sauce and maybe some pineapple juice would be great. Let’s see some pictures and a taste report when you get it done.
Best,
G

Mike:
For breakfast links I use only the tubed natural sheep casings. They are expensive, but the tubed casing mounts on your stuffer tube so much easier than the sheep casing in a hank that they are well worth the price. Austin–not an excuse to raise prices! Mike, I think you will be much happier with natural casings.
Good luck!
G